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Hard Enough - Chapter 256 - The Hoenn Circuit

🕑 Added 2024-09-10 19:00:08 +0000 UTC

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the pyro stick figure 76

When Brawley came back for his rematch it was mentioned that that was his eighth badge. So we know that Brock simply keeps the same challenge for a fourth tier, the only other gym leader we know that currently has a challenge for the eighth badge specifically is Sabrina. (as it was mentioned that ash had to fight her eighth badge team and has lost badly) As for Wallace using personal Pokémon for the eighth badge. I'm fairly certain that that Swampert was on his personal team, but I doubt that was the standard as she mentioned she never seen them before and Wallace specifically apologized for increasing the challenge more than he normally does.

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

I... kind of forgot Mt. Silver is closed to most trainers. What with Brock planning a visit up there and all. Plus, I think I was under the impression that getting in the top 16 of *any* League would qualify a trainer to visit Mt. Silver? But that doesn't really make sense in retrospect... It would allow too many non-Indigo people access to OP Indigo native pokemon (yes, non Indigo folks can get in the top 16 of Indigo, but I think on average it's more Indigo people in the Indigo League. Ergo, more Indigo natives in the top 16). Opening up to *any* League's top 16 would open Indigo up to way to much poaching. Plus, they would have to regulate out Leagues who might not be at Indigo level. A member of the top 16 of the Orange Islands League is (probably) not the same level of top 16 of Indigo or Hoen. And while everyone *knows* that, it's a political nightmare to say the quiet thing out loud. "Ah yes, you in particular fail to provide strong trainers" is not going to go down well. And even if your neighbor is physically weaker, that doesn't mean they can't fuckup your life/day/country. (Embargo, preventing access to their regional pokemon, sabotage... the list is endless). Better to just... restrict everyone's access and say only top 16 of *your* League can visit the special spot.

the pyro stick figure 76

I personally I don't see how the mount silver fire would affect any of the trainers currently in the Gym circuit. Keep in mind it's a very restricted area that you need to get permission to enter, what and that permission is usually only granted as a reward for getting top 16 in the indigo League. The only reason Brocks thinking about taking any of the trainers he's sponsoring up there is because that's one of the benefits he has as the pewter city gym leader.

Jean Marc Kunnen

the mt. silver incident wouldn't impact the average visiting trainer either as you have to place in the top 8 or 4 in the league conference to even visit it.

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

I don't recall the tidbit about Sabrina having an Elite challenge, but I'll take your word for it. As for the Tentacruel thing? Yes, it would garner attention, but would it have an *impact* on the average trainer? The city doesn't have a Gym and I'm fairly certian it's not on a route to/from a Gym. Citizens of Kanto/Indigo were probably impacted, but my question is "Does this impact trainers, specifically from foreign countries visiting Kanto?" Because, frankly, I don't think it *would* impact the average visiting trainer. The fact the Tentacruel went Giant would be covered up by the League (I think), so outside of some conservationist interest in preserving the waters, or Kanto citizens worried about their neighbors, I can't see how this would impact a typical trainer. EDIT: At least, it wouldn't impact them in comparison to the Rocket Raid which shut down two Major and one minor Gym in Kanto which greatly impacted how trainers go about getting their Badges

Jean Marc Kunnen

i think surge mentioned something about sabrina having an elite challenge during brocks battle against lance but that was very early in the fic and a lot of early lore for this fic has changed since then. also the incident in porta vista with the giant tentacreul probably garnered a lot of attention, a good amount of people did die during the incident and a death toll always attracts peoples attention on the news.

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

Can we get a chapter with a random NPC POV? By that I mean some random trainer from outside Kanto/Indigo who came to Kanto for the season. I want their thoughts on what the Kanto Gyms are like, the locals, the events, and so on. Mostly I'm curious about what has been going on that Brock hasn't notice. Are other Gyms offering Elite challenges? I think Sabrina would be down to offer something like that. Did other cities start advertising for their own contests? I can absolutely see Erika or the Cerulean sisters setting something up. What have the battles Lance has the Elite 4 running around doing look like? They seem to draw crowds but Brock hasn't watched any to our knowledge. Did the "natural disasters" that destroyed Mt. Silver (Moltores) and that coastal town (giant Tentacruel) have negative side effects on trainers? I would think the coastal town wouldn't garner much interest, but the Mt. Silver destruction probably set some people's goals back a bit. (More experienced trainers unable to go on a tyrunt hunt) Did Team Rocket getting caught in mass affect anything? I bet after Team Rocket was caught people realized how many pokemon being sold on the black market were due to team rocket. Wonder if black market buyers asked their pokemon if they had previous owners... Did other cities host month long carnivals like Pewter? Personally I always saw that as a bad solution to a problem that just created it's own long-term issues and might actually be a huge part of why the mayor of Pewter was fired.

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

I completely forgot about that! You're right, that would be 4th level/tier. I guess Wallace uses his Elite for his 4th Tier, while Brock uses his pre-elite pokemon. Does that mean Brock's 4th Tier is easier than Wallace or that Brock has higher "level" pokemon? Hmm... both. I think it's a little of both. Brock's fighting style is a bit brawly and when he first started to do Ace challenges he leaned a little heavy on having a higher power level than his opponents (he's changed a lot and is trickier now). So it makes sense that his 4th tier would need to be his non-elite pokemon or he would just crush the challengers by throwing a level ~50+ pokemon on their level ~35-40 pokemon. Wallace's fight style, however, leans towards trickieness. Which means he can afford to fight with lower "level" pokemon as the tricks they know and use makeup for any gap in firepower. That means Wallace can use his elite team for 4th tier, and he can adjust the trickieness level for individual trainers (unlike Brock who, at least in the beginning of the story, couldn't really sandbag with a pokemon like Bertha). Also, Wallace typically fights higher badge challengers. That means his average challenger is probably a bit more mature, or at least more experienced, than Brock's standard challenger. So when Wallace goes to design the 4th tier challenge, he's thinking "Challengers will understand why I sandbag if they notice" while Brock is thinking "Challengers that notice sandbagging are a pain to deal with." As a result, Brock doesn't even consider bringing in and sandbaging with his Elite.

Jean Marc Kunnen

he's talking about wallace being champion before steven in the anime while in the games wallace was champion after steven.

Jason Sampson

Ash is still in Kanto. We may still be on the anime timeline.

Jean Marc Kunnen

it could be that viva didn't realise they were different like that. i certainly didn't until i looked it up.

Jean Marc Kunnen

didn't brawly and the other future hoenn gym leaders challange brock at the fourth tier? edit: i read the chapter where brawly's first introduced again and brock called it the fourth level but he used sudowoodo and solrock, both pokemon brock considers a step below his elite level, so i think the author meant the fourth tier.

BotsBoy 408

Nice congrats Celia in over coming this hurdle. Also I love that Mr Mine's is like the Pokemon version of Mc'Donalds

Cielo Ontiveros

Yaaaaasssss!!! So happy to see some of Celia in Hoenn!! It was awesome to see a little more of how Celia is marching along and growing on her Journey. ❤️❤️ I really enjoyed to the battle comparisons and gym in this chapter. It was so exciting to dip into a completely different style.

nugitoBambino

I gotta say, really impressive decision making from Celia. Someone like Wallace offered to teach me I would have jumped on it without thinking about if we were a good fit. Go her!

angie bell

oh, more contests in the future~???

Jericho Rising

That's an interesting take on it. I like it.

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

I think it would be fun to see Brock vs. Wallace. I think Wallace would fight a bit like a more experienced Kaede (did I spell her name right?); plenty of tricks and lots of showmanship. I think Brock would relish the chance to battle and/or learn from Wallace. I mean, look at how much Brock learned and grew from one fight against Kaede!

the pyro stick figure 76

Any particular reason for the change to the original game timeline of events for the champion instead of using the timeline from the animes?

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

I actually think that (1 of Brock's personal pokemon vs. a trainer's whole team of 6) would place higher than an 8th Badge (4th tier) in difficulty level. Most circuit trainers (i.e. Gym challengers) are on their first circuit with a few on their second or third. Most don't keep going after three circuits (money being a factor plus, what do they get out of continuing to challenge Gyms after earning over 20 badges?). So I think it's more like: 1st Tier: 1st Badge 2nd Tier: 2nd/3rd Badge 3rd Tier: 4th/5th/6th Badge 4th Tier: 7th/8th Badge 5th Tier: Fight one of Brock's Personal Pokémon All but 5th level can have Gauntlet runs (that's when they face 1-3 trainers before Brock) and the Gauntlet run is adjusted for each Badge level. What I'm saying, is that Brock does Tiers 1-3 and Tier 5, but no tier 4. The first three are him just giving trainers a bit of a nudge or challenge. 5th tier is Brock doing his best with the equivalent of his hands tied behind his back. So what is 4th tier? Wallace used his personal pokemon (one of whom was his starter!) for 8th Badge level. But if Brock did that I think it would be overkill...

MacDoc-101

He has the option for elite challenge or something like that for trainers to come back and fight later on if I’m remembering right which I’d assume is roughly 8th tier

Noctus Tagaris

oh no lol. wallance is not going to let that "second" comment go haha. poor juan

Donald Bagwell

Honestly Wallace is an interesting character. I also want a talk between Wallace and Brock just because Brock knows this man is also a champion and the insanity he brings

HonorBound Fate

Good to finally see Celia again. It’s been a long time coming, but she’s certainly showing her potential.

Carter

Great chapter!

Vara

I want Brock and Wallace to fight. They have completely the opposite approach to battles.

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

After seeing how another Gym Leader hosts an 8th Badge challenge, it will be interesting to see how Brock handles late season badge hunters. We know how Brock fights trainers looking for 1-4th badges (i.e. 1st through 3rd tier), but I doubt he uses the same methods for higher level badges. *giggle* Wait. *giggles some more* Has Brock ever fought a trainer for anything above a 6th badge??? He's the go to for the 1st Badge and, until a few months ago, everyone thought he wasn't a real challenge. Is Brock going to face his first 7th or 8th Badge (4th tier) this year? Has he ever hosted a 4th tier Badge trial? I think it would be kind of funny if we see Brock having to do a 4th tier Badge, and he and his trainers have to reach out to Sabrina to ask what power level and tricks are appropriate to use at 7th or 8th Badge level. Also, does Brock play the role of Heel for a higher level Badge the way he does with newbies? Or does he change it out for something closer to how he is with some Ace challenges? (I.e. casually relaxed, like the opponent isn't a real challenge, but he's going to enjoy the fight anyway)

Wolf Eiyn

Great chapter. Love seeing more Celia!

HoldTightAndPretendItsAPlan

Loved this! I really enjoyed the update on how Celia is doing, but especially in how her experience with the Gyms of Hoen has gone. It makes sense that she would breeze through them a bit, what with her doing so well at the Indigo Tournament last year. Having her struggle against someone not just because of their pokemon power, but because of *how* they use their pokemon so differently than Celia is used to was great! I think it would be fun to have Celia teach Brock a thing or two. He isn't very familiar with contests, and Indigo/Kanto is very forward and blunt about their fight styles. I think he would really enjoy learning more about different styles.

Qweku_v

Wonderful chapter

Samuel Kutten

Great chap

Tom

TFTC


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