Mike Mearls Games
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Odyssey Initiative
🕑 Added 2025-04-15 16:48:51 +0000 UTCI started a Shadowdark game that runs on Wednesdays. I wanted to run a game that was just for fun, with no playtesting or game design riding on it.
So of course, I started tinkering with initiative. Shadowdark's approach - roll for initiative, high roll goes first then wheel around the table - is a little tricky to run online. I use Zoom, and the players don't necessarily have the same arrangement of speakers on their view of the call.
I have also learned a few things about initiative over the past year of running AD&D, OSE, Shadowdark, and 5e. Here are my design goals:
I want initiative to resolve quickly.
I want it to have a noticeable effect on an encounter.
I want it to lead to dramatic die rolls.
I want some characters to be better at it than others.
I don't want to roll for the monsters because I want to make life easier for DMs. I have enough to track that I don't want to do a bunch of bookkeeping.
As an example, a few years back I ran a science fiction hack of OSE at Gamehole Con. The characters had confronted the weirdo, psychic alien that had taken over a space station. They had blasted it to the point of near death, but its mental control abilities had taken a toll on the group.
OSE uses team initiative, and the battle came down to the last initiative roll. If the players won, they could finish off the alien. If they lost, there was a good chance that the alien would control their minds.
That roll was incredibly tense and fun, and the players cheered when they won it and finished off the alien in a hail of laser fire.
In fact, team-based initiative is so fun and fast that I was very tempted to make it the default. However, in my experience it can be a little too swingy for my tastes. For boss monsters especially, I like the back and forth of player goes, then DM goes.
Here is what I settled on. I ran this system at Gary Con and have refined it in my Shadowdark game. I wrote up the rules for Odyssey, and here they are from the playtest rulebook:
Initiative
Initiative determines the order in which everyone acts during a fight.
Seizing the Initiative
At the start of each round, each player character can attempt to seize the initiative by making a DC 20 trained Dexterity check. Characters who succeed seize the initiative that round.
Shadowdark Note: Odyssey uses proficiency bonus, while Shadowdark does not. To compensate, use a base DC 15 when using this approach in Shadowdark.
Design Note: The DC can vary based on the encounter. For instance, against a horde of zombies the DC is 10.
Order of Play
All characters who seized the initiative act in an order of their choice.
The DM then chooses an NPC to take their turn. The DM might be able to have more than one NPC or monster take a turn, depending on the type of creature they choose. For instance, if the DM takes a turn for a minion they instead take a turn for four minions.
After the DM takes their turn or turns, one character who has not yet acted this round takes a turn.
Play alternates, with the DM taking a turn after the players, the players taking a turn, and so on until everyone in the encounter has taken a turn. If one side or the other has taken all their turns but the other has not yet finished, the side that is not yet done takes all of their remaining turns. The round then ends.
Comments
Ryan Mueller
If I am understanding this correctly the order is this. 1. Round starts, players can choose to seize initiative (4 players do, 2 succeed and 2 fail) 2.The successful players get to go 1st in whatever order they choose. 3. The GM now chooses a monster to take its turn after the Successful players. 4. A player who failed to seize initiative or chose not to try gets to go. 5. A new Gm monster takes its turn. This repeats until all players who did not seize initiative have gone and the Gm's creatures have taken turns. 6. New round starts and players can choose to seize initiative again The seizing the initiative thing makes me think of Shadow of the Weird Wizard. In that game you must use your triggered action to seize initiative. This is a big decision since your triggered action is in 5e terms both your reaction and bonus action. In this system I don't know why you would not want to try to seize initiative since going before the enemies is basically always good. It makes me feel like there should be some sort of penalty for trying to seize initiative and failing, or some sort of bonus you get for choosing not to try to seize initiative that a failing character does not get.
David Canela
If I’m reading this correctly, this can easily result in different participants in a combat taking a different number of turns between any participant’s turns. So if Player A goes first in the first round and goes last in the second round, everyone else will have taken 2 turns by the time Player A acts for a second time. This means abilities and (spell) effects don’t always last for the same number of turns, unless we word them so they count turns or something. In 5e, this would seriously mess things up. If it’s done intentionally, it can add a level of strategic depth (for instance like in Gloomhaven). Some folks will love that. It certainly doesnkt sound like something that would streamline or speed up things, though. Am I missing something?
